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WNCFLY
03-19-2008, 03:34 PM
I have a good friend of mine who I am trying to convince to start fly fishing with me. He is a avid spinner fisherman , which is perfectly fine with me. I do give him a hard time sometimes by telling him how much he would enjoy fly fishing over the spinning method. He says he just doesn't like the "yuppie" attitude of the fly fisherman he has encountered. He believes when he goes into some of the fly shops with me that the people there talk down too him. I got to thinking about this and was wondering, am I a so called "yuppie". Although I think its crazy that there are $700 waders and $800 reels, I don't mind dropping good money for quality products. I have over $500 invested in my rood and reel together and absolutely love them. They are guaranteed for life, so why not spend a little extra. He thinks spending this money is crazy. Well anyways I just thought this was a funny subject and want to see what other fellow fly fisherman thought?

jeffnles1
03-19-2008, 03:51 PM
Sure there are "yuppie snobs" in fly fishing. Just like there are "redneck jerks" in bass spinner and baitcast fishing. That does not mean all bass fishermen are redneck jerks any more than it means all fly fishermen are "yuppie snobs".

There are sterotypes for nearly all aspects of the sport with people who use worms and minnows being somewhere toward the bottom in the respect hierarchy. It does not mean that all or even a significant number of peopple fit that description, but some do and they stand out and therefore become what others tend to see and key in on.

With that off of my chest, I better finish my double mocha latte before I get in my 5 series and drive off. I wouldn't want to spill any on the seats or stain my khakis. :smile:

Jeff

JimmyC
03-19-2008, 04:17 PM
Jeff! Funny stuff ...

I guess I'm a redneck hybrid; a product of Sevier County, so red by proxy. You know, acting for that "other" in me. That comes out in me when I am grabbed by family and made to sit in a john boat and fish sauger, walleye, or bass. I like it a lot, but it's not a day wading the Clinch or hiking in the GSMNP. I like to move and enjoy the scenery and not worry about falling overboard when relieving myself. Anyway, the given is I would fly fish anywhere, and spin fish when family time comes. But I guess I'm lucky since the same people who drag me off spinning are the same who I drag fly fishing ...

By the way, my job forces me to "look the part." Therefore I have a few shirts with little crocodiles on them even some nice flat fronts by old Ralph. I guess what further seperates me from THAT pack is I buy clearance at the outlets during the off season.

James

PeteCz
03-19-2008, 04:27 PM
Flyfishing has its share of "yuppies", but I think the issue is more with attitudes than "yuppie-ness". I started flyfishing in Colorado, and almost gave it up because of the attitude in most fly shops that I went into, out there. It was very elitist and that attitude made it hard for a beginner to ask questions and get started.

I think that this part of the country has much less of the elitism of other areas, but it does exist. However, if we look at it honestly, I think its really a society wide issues ranging across all pursuits, not just flyfishing. You can find it in all sports and hobbies.

I flyfish, not because I think I'm better than spincasters, but because I like the method better. I don't nymph fish all that much for the same reason. Could I catch more and larger fish? Of course. But I like watching a fish rise to inspect a fly more than just the catching part.

As for pricing of equipment, I can see where your friend is going with that point. But they don't have to spend a great deal of money if they don't want to. They could get a completely serviceable setup for less than $200 (including rod, reel, line, flies and some gadgets). The same pricing issue applies to almost everything. Look at cars. You could spend a lot or a little to transport yourself around, it all depends on what you feel comfortable spending, no makes you buy an expensive car...including a 3 series. Of course you shouldn't ask me, I drive a 92 Ford Explorer and my wife drives a Volvo...what do I know.

I'm with Jimmy as well. My brother is a huge redneck, but he lives in Buffalo. I have a few Polo button down shirts, but I bought them on clearance. I hate Starbucks...Of course you shouldn't ask me, I drive a 92 Ford Explorer and my wife drives a Volvo...what do I know...

Jack M.
03-19-2008, 04:43 PM
If you are fishing for Bass from a boat, you have more $ in your equipment than I do, and I'm talking about an aluminum jonboat-- not to mention what some of these bass boats cost ya'.

BlueRaiderFan
03-19-2008, 06:42 PM
I don't pull in enough coin to be a yuppie lol. Just ask Bill at LOR. He had to dig through the warehouse to find a set of waders that I could afford! (Or at least that I was willing to buy). To me, fly fishing is the opposite of yuppiness (I think I just made up a word). In reality, you can buy a combo, a fly box and some flies and a decent set of boots and a vest and you are set for around $200. If you can't stand the cold water, a cheap set of waders is around $120. Not exactly big money. I have had great expereinces in fly shops in Nashville and I definitely had a great expereince at Little River Outfitters. They were VERY nice and helpful and when it was obvious that I was trying to work within a budget, they weren't snobby about it at all...I mean not in the least. Why would a person that stands in the middle of a river or stream trying to catch a fish be a snob? I could see it if it involved making deals on Wall Street or playing Pebble Beach, but this is FISHING for Pete's sake lol! Just my thoughts on the subject.

fishNlady
03-19-2008, 07:23 PM
Well, me and the hubby definitely would not be considered yuppies. Blue collar jobs and living in a doublewide in Cosby is pretty non yuppie. :) I have met the type that you are talking about though. The ones with the "attitude" But having more $$ to spend on gear don't make them better fishermen. That takes skill and the cost of that is practice and dedication.

I think people like that have that kind of snob attitude in whatever they do, be it fly fishing or anything else. They are missing the real beauty of the sport.

nvr2L8
03-19-2008, 08:55 PM
I challenge anyone to look at the LRO Message Board and characterize this particular community of fly fisherpersons as snobby.

When some of the most responded-to posts are sympathy for a man who has just lost his dog and a brother who is quitting smoking. When novices like me can ask silly questions and make sillier comments and the responses reflect patience and understanding. When we can laugh together at a story of a taser at Christmas and offer a teenager with high ideals career advice. When the community can celebrate with a beginner catching the first trout in the Smokies and respond without guile to the 25th question about the CSF. And we can still have lively but civil debates on fish mortality, the price of license plates, bamboo vs. plastics, mono vs. fluorocarbon.

This is not a gathering of snobs, it's a community of folks with a common interest in fly fishing (regardless of how much or how little we've spent on our rigs) and a universal interest in each other. Yeah, some of us wear khakis and a nice shirt to work but that's not what defines us. Our passion for fly fishing and our concern for each other define us.

Tight lines, big hearts.

snaildarter
03-19-2008, 09:34 PM
Many overly broad sentiments like those expressed by WNCFLY's friend, although unfair when applied to any particular person, have a little truth to them. Let me demonstrate by asking a few questions:

1) Do you think of folks who dunk corn for trout to be of below average social class, average, or above average?
2) What about folks who mostly catfish?
3) Golfers?
4) Nascar fans?

I think that although we may be fast to defend flyfishing, and maybe deny the yuppie nature of it, well, lets also think hard about our views of the social status of people in other activities, and maybe that will give us a more complete framework for viewing the things we do. For example, I think that it is 100% certain that if I randomly gather 100 people who primarily catfish, and 100 people that flyfish, the flyfishers are gonna have a MUCH higher income as a group.

Of course, one can't use that to point at a particular individual, and say, "You are a yuppie because you flyfish." If a poor person wants to flyfish, he can. If a rich person wants to catfish, he can. And sometimes this actually happens.

Personally, I think flyfishing still has far too many pretentious, snotty types. I've been in a western fly shop, while wearing a baseball cap and t-shirt, and felt the eyeballs of the staffers, wearing their $400 Bean outfits and $100 Filson hats, burning a whole in me. The woman manning the cash register acted as though I were dipped in sewage (trust me, I wasn't). And she acted this way even though I'm trying to buy stuff in her store!

But I also know a lot of great, down-to-earth flyfishers too. And I love to flyfish too, so scr** what anyone else thinks about it. I love catfishing with a 6-pack, lounge chairs, and a bucket of fried chicken as well.

I'll have to say that nvr2L8's view about the message board seems right on... The folks of this forum certainly seem more down to earth than the average flyfishing community. In fact, by and large, I think the people on LRO's forum are wonderful. And I'll also add that LRO is the best fly shop I have ever been in, partly because I don't think Byron would ever hire a pretentious snob.

nvr2L8
03-19-2008, 10:51 PM
Snaildarter,

I'll have to admit that your questions gave me pause. I had to reflect on how I personally viewed those that participate in other aspects of fishing. I started out fishing as a bait and corn caster. I enjoyed occasional fishing and caught a few stockers. Then I started spin fishing in the Smokies and I haven't been back to the bait casting. As folks have said in many posts, a 5 inch native trout in the Smokies is a lot more fun than one three times that size in a stocked stream in terms of fight per ounce. And there's no comparison when it comes to surroundings. I was a rooster tail spin fisher for about 30 years in the park before I broke down and learned to fly fish last year. And my spinning rigs are now gathering dust in a corner of my study. As much as I enjoyed spin fishing, it doesn't come close for me to the challenge and fun of fly fishing. As I've evolved from bait to rooster tails to flies, I don't feel at all like I've climbed a social ladder. I've simply moved to a form of fishing that brings me so much more enjoyment than anything I've tried before. I'll never have a freezer full of fish with fly fishing but I've never had more fun.

I don't believe that I look down my nose at grabblers so much as it just doesn't appeal to me as a sport. Neither does roaring around a lake in a bass boat. For me, the quieter and technically challenging version of fishing that uses dry flies rather than 6 hook, jointed bodied 7" lures is simply more appealing. And it has nothing to do with social status so much as personal preference.

I'll also admit that next winter, I may dust off a spinning rig, go get a 1/8 ounce black rooster tail and go after a Little River brown.

Interesting that the examples of snobby, pretentious fly fishers seem to be more western in flavor. Maybe in our part of the world we're all bait fishers at heart with fly rods in our hands.

jeffnles1
03-20-2008, 12:32 AM
Maybe in our part of the world we're all bait fishers at heart with fly rods in our hands.

Charlie,
that is a true pearl of wisdom. I think you may be on to something.

Jeff

rainshaker
03-20-2008, 03:14 AM
He says he just doesn't like the "yuppie" attitude of the fly fisherman he has encountered. He believes when he goes into some of the fly shops with me that the people there talk down too him.

Not that it applies to the context of this particular discussion, but "Yuppie" is actually a Socio-economic anagram used to describe Young Urban Professionals. Likewise, a "Dink" describes a working couple with no kids
(i.e. Double Income No Kids)

Just thought I'd throw that in...since I might be defined as a "Yuppie".....OK maybe except for the "young" part.

:smile:

Grumpy
03-20-2008, 07:51 AM
I have the best equipment, waders, rods/reels, i'm broke, i'm not a yuppie, I CATCH FISH:biggrin:

Grumpy

WNCFLY
03-20-2008, 08:12 AM
Does anyone on here have the Simms waders that cost $700? I just want to know what a pair of waders that expensive feel like. lol. I figure I might try on a pair one day just to see...

Brian Griffing
03-20-2008, 08:43 AM
For me, chasing trout with a fly fills the niche in fishing that chasing deer with a bow fills in hunting. They both require study, practice, and patience. They are both sub-cultures of their larger respective sports, and they are both an exercise of form over function.
This is not to say that I turn my nose up at either rifle hunting or other kinds of fishing. I just get a greater deal of personal satisfaction from the form of flyfishing and bowhunting.
So here's my question: Why are bow-hunters cast in a different light than flysfisherman? If it is for actual dollars spent on the sport, after broadheads, scents, tree-stands, clothes, liscenses, ATV, etc., I spend more on bowhunting than on flyfishing. What about waterfowling? Boats, decoys, waders, calls, lights, dogs, dog training, etc. How about deep-sea fishing? I don't even know the equipment you would need for that, but I am sure it costs more than my Orvis 5-wt, or my Browning compound.
Now I'm rambling. But as I haven't come across any pretentious yuppies on this board, I'll assume you forgive me.

buzzmcmanus
03-20-2008, 09:39 AM
I'm kind of with Brian on this. Fly-fishing just fills a niche for me. If the game warden told me I could shoot deer all year long, I would never get out of a treestand. I also spend way more money on my hunting equipment than I do on my fishing equipment. I do run into a few people with the "better than you" attitude on the stream. However, if you saw my fishing outfit, you'd understand. Cut off camo pants, an old t-shirt that most people wouldn't discrace their rag bin with, and a ball cap that must 15 years old, lets not forget the cheap garage sale looking fly rod.

ThatredneckguyJamie
03-20-2008, 10:38 AM
I'm too new to flyfishing to have experienced anything like this yet...but if it happens I'll treat it the same as I do anything else in life...Lifes too short to be bothered with the ignorance of others

snaildarter
03-20-2008, 11:01 AM
I was thinking a little more about Charlie's point that these forums seem devoid of snobbishness. I think that maybe it's because no one on here can physically see a person's expensive, perfectly matched outfit. The kinds of people that do that maybe aren't so interested in fishing as much as portraying an image. So why would someone like that have a desire to ever get on a forum like this? Everyone on this forum really likes fishing, and has no opportunity to judge the others based on what they look like. We talk (type) about things like trout mortality, bears, snakes, and nymphs.

buzzmcmanus
03-20-2008, 11:10 AM
I was thinking a little more about Charlie's point that these forums seem devoid of snobbishness. I think that maybe it's because no one on here can physically see a person's expensive, perfectly matched outfit. The kinds of people that do that maybe aren't so interested in fishing as much as portraying an image. So why would someone like that have a desire to ever get on a forum like this? Everyone on this forum really likes fishing, and has no opportunity to judge the others based on what they look like. We talk (type) about things like trout mortality, bears, snakes, and nymphs.

And don't forget the occasional stripper, or striper

JimmyC
03-20-2008, 01:00 PM
Ain't no snobs here!

Whoa! My wife and I are Dinks! I've been called worse, not sure about her ...

rainshaker
03-20-2008, 01:48 PM
On the other hand, I've met several very kind, honest, generous, hard- working people that just happen to be $loaded$ and fish with very expensive fly rods.

And....I've also been in at least a couple of locally owned fly shops here in (where I live) where I was treated more like a nuisance rather than someone who might want to trade cash for goods.

There seems to be a stereotype that people who are "wealthy" have obviously found their money by way of cheating or stealing and therefore don't deserve anything they worked for.......or at the very least, consider themselves better than everyone else.

I'm not crying sympathy for the financially-responsible, I'm just saying money isn't required before one can act like a complete and total !&%$@#$%!

BuckeyeRick
03-20-2008, 02:18 PM
Whenever a tackle fisherman starts to look at me like I'm an elitist with my fly rod, I just scratch, spit, put one finger by my nose and blow and then wipe it on my shirtsleeve. That'll change their attitude.

Bran
03-20-2008, 03:43 PM
I love to FF as much as anyone but most times I'm on a stream, river, lake, or a pond with my 4 weight I'll also be working on a big chew of tobacco! (The old "twist" stuff Granddaddy used to chew, Mammoth Cave)http://littleriveroutfitters.com/forum/images/icons/icon7.gif Now if that's yuppy, I'll eat my hat!

ThatredneckguyJamie
03-20-2008, 03:57 PM
lol I've usually got a fat pinch of mint skoal but occasionally I'll take a plug of Levi Garrett :)

18inchbrown
03-20-2008, 03:58 PM
Well, I had to respond to this post. I am a son of a mill hunk born on the wrong side of the tracks in a mill town in Pa. I was born in a row house and we shared walls with the neighbors. I learned to fish with worms and corn and used to fish in the old days when the turds used to float from the treatment plant into the good old Susquehanna. I am 55 years old.

Flash forward to now. I started fly fishing because it was the way to fish in the Smokies which I do whenever I visit. I like wearing Simms waders and I have a pair of Simms wading boots. My favorite trout setup is my Scott 3wt. E2 I believe with a Ross Evolution reel with a 70$ Rio flyline. I have a wood landing net attached to a magnetic zinger on my back. I use a Filson strap vest. If you saw me on the stream, I suppose a lot of people would pre-judge me as a "Yuppie" fly fisherman. The reality is I don't want to climb the learning curve and I can afford it. I personally resent people from both ends of the spectrum, that being people who buy the gear to be an elitist and the people who would never buy the gear because they are elitists on the other end. Just have confidence in who you are and judge people by their character.

John B

Troutman
03-20-2008, 05:00 PM
Good comments 18"Brown. Way to much judging of people by appearances in this world. I have to dress for my workplace, trousers and dress shirt, sometimes a tie. Does that make me a yuppy? I think not, just uncomfortable at times. I wore a dress uniform sometimes while in the military. I was still the same person when wearing fatigues.
No matter the choice of clothing or fishing equipment, we are just fishermen enjoying it while were still physically able and if you want the best performing gear and can afford it, them by all means get it. I've run into a few stores over the years where the employees would make you feel unappreciated. I don't think any of the "flyshops" around here are like that. If they were, I wouldn't support their business.