View Full Version : This couldn't happen in GSMNP, could it? Be safe out there!

02-19-2011, 02:47 AM
Removed by author!

02-19-2011, 07:49 AM
Good grief....with all these predators (coyotes, bears, otters, wampus cats, bats, garter snakes and man eating quill gordons) about I may just give up fishing an reading about fishing all together.

old east tn boy
02-19-2011, 09:23 AM
Grouseman, don't quit. Take Magnum along for protection! How big is he?

Ms. Annie is 70 pounds and still growing. She would love to play with a coyote, not defend me!

Two years ago a coyote ran through my yard in broad day light, had all the dogs in the neighborhood in an uproar. And it was huge!

02-19-2011, 10:31 AM
TN has some of thee bigger coyotes that I have ever seen. Ive shot a few while deer hunting, and their size always amazes me. Also, I believe it may have been linked on this message board, the video of the coyote killing and dragging into the woods a full size white tail deer along the North River. I live at the edge of the foothills in blount county, I hear "yotes" all the time (well at night at least), and I know people who have lost pets out of their yards. Coyotes are a "smart" animal. They will use deception to lure dogs into the woods, and they will hunt in packs. There is a season on them and it is open 365 days a year, UNLESS you hunt on public land. Then you can only shoot them with a caliber gun appropriate for whaatever other game is in season. Now TWRA admits we have a coyote issue, that they need to be thinned and hunted, yet they make it near impossible to hunt them on public land. kind of dis appointing.

02-19-2011, 11:01 AM
Over the past few years the hunter deer harvest in Maine totally plummeted; mostly due to coyotes. 38K deer or so were typically harvested and the numbers fell to under 18K harvested...

Just before we moved here all three of our cats were eaten by coyotes right out of our front yard... the sad part is they left scat in the yard that contained the same color hair as the missing pets.

Oddly here in Seymour we hear them quite often at night on the hill across the road from us but we've never seen them.

I saw a huge coyote in Gatlinburg near Greenbriar in October... I'm not certain that ONLY northern coyotes are larger but I do think there is a "wolf gene" in Northern coyotes as most I've seen weigh well over 60 pounds.

Two years ago in Maine we had more coyote photos on our trail cams than deer.

02-19-2011, 11:38 AM
We had Timbers (Eastern Grey Wolf) in Indiana as far back as 1964, when I was 18 years old. They were living in the wilds of a nearby military reservation impact area. No body, even military ventured into this area, because of the presence of un-detonated high explosive ordnance. I deer hunted with a friend of mine at his uncle's farm across the road from the perimeter fence. Occasionally you could here explosions in the middle of the night. He told me this was due to the wolves moving the deer around at night on their hunts. Years went by and the wolves began territorial expansion outside the military area. All the while they were being reported, our DNR were denying their existence.

About ten years ago, a trapper caught a timberwolf in a leg hold trap in a river bottom some forty miles away from the military reservation. He took photograph's for the newspaper and they were published. DNR could no longer deny they were around.

In 2004, one jumped a farm fence on a full run right into the path of my car about 5 miles from those river bottoms. I was doing about 45 mph, and hit it a glancing blow. It didn't kill it, but it was injured and unconscious. It weighed about 140 lbs. and had very thick fur and bushy tail. It was a timberwolf. I dispatched it with my handgun and turned it over to Purdue University for studies.

I'm wondering, after seeing the program on NGC, about the coyotes inbreeding with Grey Wolves, if that isn't the explanation for some of the huge coyotes we are now seeing in the south woods of Indiana.

Many old native Americans believe that as man overcrowds his habitat and destroys natural habitat for the animals, that the animals will rise up and nature will retaliate by overtaking man's domain and hunting him as prey. Perhaps man brings that on himself by taking wild animals as "pets". You can nurse a wild thing from birth and "tame it" to a certain extent, but you can't change its DNA. They are still wild.

There has been far too many sightings of mountain lions, wolves, bears with cubs, complete with landmarked photograph's in Indiana to dispute the facts. Nearly everyone carries a cell phone camera these days.

Science can't be everywhere and see everything. Many times they become skeptical and not fair minded about it. This is understandable, they are only human and there are a lot of false reports.

When we are in GSMNP and surrounding areas, we are not in our park so much as we are in their domain!

Everyone keep alert and be prepared for the wilderness and what it offers!
Stay safe and have an enjoyable time.

When the ice finally leaves our lakes up here, I'm going trout fishing! It's been a pretty rough winter.

02-19-2011, 12:13 PM
One thing no State wants to know is that WOLVES or COUGARS inhabit there jurisdictional land mass.

For years there has been irrefutable evidence, tracks, fur (DNA) etc. of wolves and cougars in Maine including photographic and eye witness accounts of both animals BUT officially the State decides that these critters "must be the result of illegal introductions"!

This is because IF there were indeed wolves or cougars consideration for listing under THE ENDANGERED SPECIES ACT would need to be given.

At the moment Maine claims both animals are "EXTIRPATED" and therefore no consideration under the ESA which would require the State to spend money on a "plan" or on studies or on management.

It's easy to deny these critters roam around Maine but too many people I know (including my mom) have seen them.


02-19-2011, 12:32 PM
I just got this in an e-mail and thought that it might be appropriate.


The Governor of California is jogging with his dog along a nature trail.

A coyote jumps out and attacks the Governor's dog, then bites the Governor.

1. The Governor starts to intervene, but reflects upon the movie "Bambi" and then realizes he should stop because the coyote is only doing what is natural.

2. He calls animal control . Animal Control captures the coyote and bills the State $200 testing it for diseases and $500 for relocating

3. He calls a veterinarian. The vet collects the dead dog and bills the State $200 testing it for diseases.

4. The Governor goes to hospital and spends $3,500 getting checked for diseases from the coyote and on getting his bite wound bandaged.

5. The running trail gets shut down for 6 months while Fish & Game conducts a $100,000 survey to make sure the area is now free of
dangerous animals.

6. The Governor spends $50,000 in state funds implementing a "coyote awareness program" for residents of the area.

7. The State Legislature spends $2 million to study how to better treat rabies and how to permanently eradicate the disease throughout the world.

8. The Governor's security agent is fired for not stopping the attack. The State spends $150,000 to hire and train a new agent with
additional special training re: the nature of coyotes.

9. PETA protests the coyote's relocation and files a $5 million suit against the State.


The Governor of Texas is jogging with his dog along a nature trail. A Coyote jumps out and attacks his dog.

1. The Governor shoots the coyote with his State-issued pistol and keeps jogging. The Governor has spent $0.50 on a .45 ACP hollow point cartridge.

2. The Buzzards eat the dead coyote.

And that, my friends, is why California is broke and Texas is not.

02-19-2011, 02:06 PM
I also live near the foothills a few miles from the park out montvale road. I had a particularly scary coyote incident at night in Cades Cove a few years back. We were in there after it was closed for the day and ended up being surrounded on all sides by 50+ hungry coyotes all howling and coming straight at us. I recounted it at the time here:


We got the **** out of there but it was pretty scary. I knew there were coyotes in there but never imagined that so many could be on you so fast.

02-19-2011, 02:13 PM
Personally, I think everyone should stay home this season. Way to dangerous to fish or do anything outdoors:rolleyes: I look forward to the solitude and less misspent on the internet.

02-19-2011, 06:44 PM
Personally, I think everyone should stay home this season. Way to dangerous to fish or do anything outdoors:rolleyes: I look forward to the solitude and less misspent on the internet.

That is exactly what I was implying... I should have included some of the smilies. :cool:

02-19-2011, 06:48 PM

I'm afraid of otters, do you have any tips on where I should fish. I've tried third creek here in Knoxville, but some teenagers came up on me and I got scared. Any help appreciated.

02-19-2011, 06:51 PM
You're going to get me in trouble. Paula hasn't busted me for quite some time. I'll get back to building my fly rods and keep quiet:redface:

Neal aka Otter Luver!

02-19-2011, 06:57 PM

I say you are right, it's fun to be ironic sometimes, the sad part is that this is the quality on here lately. It's time to move on and like you said earlier spend more time on the stream. Let's hope we can get em' tomorrow.

02-19-2011, 06:59 PM

I'm afraid of otters, do you have any tips on where I should fish. I've tried third creek here in Knoxville, but some teenagers came up on me and I got scared. Any help appreciated.


Not to worry! The only otters that are dangerous are the ones wearing motorcycle goggles! As for the teenagers, just throw them junk food or a text message. They'll go away!;)

02-19-2011, 09:38 PM
Fishing in Third Creek?....I would figure the fly line to melt down as soon as it hit the water there? As far as coyote go we have camped in Elkmont and they run right through the campground with no fear of humans looking for food scraps.

The one time that was a bit erie for me was at Metcalf bottoms picnic area it was winter so everyone left early I was still fishing and one walked right to the edge of the bank across from me. A very healthy looking animal I might add. I reached for my camera to get a photo and he turned away. I decided to psst him so I could snap a photo and when I did he stopped, dropped his head lowered his ears then snuck off up over the hill.

At that point I realized I was the only person there and decided to hit the road. Typically wildlife don't scare me but we must all remember wildlife in the park is just that WILD meaning they can be unpredictable at any given moment. Visitors to Cades Cove seem to think their in some sort of petting zoo. This is kind of a disturbing article.

02-19-2011, 10:22 PM
kind of related....I went coyote hunting for the first time the other day. I called and called my little heart out but only got an owl to come see what was making all the noise. A little later I heard the whole pack start calling. I thought "come on I got enough shells for 15 of you!" Of course they're too smart to come when I'm ready for them.:rolleyes:

As for the cougar in Indiana...that's about as controversial as the otters in the smokie streams. I had a CO tell me to shoot one if I see it....because he wanted some answers on the issue....

02-19-2011, 10:50 PM
This is kind of a disturbing article.


Besides the obvious, here's what disturbing to me.

A talented young girl's life was ended because she had no idea she was in danger. Others were more fortunate!

Four scientists spoke out in editorial fashion summarizing this incident before all the scientific evidence was in. Three out of four (75%) of the scientists were dead wrong. (Sorry for the pun).

"Brad White, a coyote expert at Trent University in Peterborough, Ont. said they might have been coyote-wolf hybrids." Correct!

"Don Anderson a biologist with the Nova Scotia Department of Natural Resources said he saw no reason to suspect the animals were coyote-wolf crosses. Don Anderson noted there are no wolves in Nova Scotia or New Brunswick." Wrong!

"Stan Gehrt, a coyote expert at Ohio State University's school of environment and natural resources suggested that the coyotes were rabid." Wrong!

"Bob Bancroft, a Nova Scotia wildlife biologist, had suggested that the coyotes were inexperienced hunters." Wrong!

"As for the cougar in Indiana...that's about as controversial as the otters in the smokie streams. I had a CO tell me to shoot one if I see it....because he wanted some answers on the issue.... "


I have one practically living in my backyard. Do you want to come and help me shoot it? It's not really bothering me, but it makes a mess with my electric fence when it drags its deer kills through the wires and tears off the insulators and downs my fence posts.

Ky Tim
03-02-2011, 11:37 PM

03-03-2011, 10:35 PM

Noted from the above article:

" The wildlife service treated the eastern cougar as a distinct subspecies, even though some biologists now believe it is genetically the same as its western brethren, which is increasing in number and extending its range."

The Western variety is alive and well and quite photogenic! The only reason to declare them extinct is to remove them from the endangered speicies list, as has been done.