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Byron Begley
02-23-2012, 08:42 PM
I heard some disturbing news this week. This is a rumor. The talk is, a person bought some property on the French Broad River at the 61 Bridge. This person intends to install a Zip-Line across the river for tourists. Additionally, this person has purchased some jet boats that are capable of transporting 20 people on tours of the French Broad River.

Has anyone heard about this?

Byron

Hugh Hartsell
02-23-2012, 09:24 PM
Byron,
Are you talking about the Hwy.66 bridge crossing the French Broad River coming from the I-40 into Sevierville/Pigeon Forge area? A very large walk out ramp has been built out over the river on the North Side just above the Old Lee Greenwood Theater. Another new building is being started in the field just as you cross the river and before you get to the knife building. The large extended ramp will be used for something like a Zip Line or viewing area. I can't tell about a boat ramp.
Hugh

waterwolf
02-23-2012, 11:30 PM
It would make no difference and you would hardly notice another jet boat or two in the mess of other jets running up and down that river. As far as the zip line, a few folks getting killed by dropping into the river at high flows, and it will go away as will the entire business.

Byron Begley
02-24-2012, 07:52 AM
Hugh,

That is the bridge from what I understand. They guy also told me the business purchased 5 jet boats capable of holding 20 passengers each. He called them New Zealand jet boats. Please keep in mind that this is a rumor.

Byron

Troutman
02-24-2012, 08:25 AM
:eek:I have seen the zipline and the docks on the river. It does not surprise me that Sevierville will allow this venture. They will do anything to bring in more tourist no matter how much it affects the natural beauty of the area. and there is not much of that left. I didn't know about the jet boat tours. Hopefully it wont last. :mad:

No Hackle
02-24-2012, 12:04 PM
Byron I have a friend on the utility board in Sevierville. He told me about it in January. Pretty sure those are no rumors. I think he's already been involved in some work for this also.I may be mistaken on my last point. I'll see what I can find out. Will be @ his house this weekend.
Lynn

Troutman
02-24-2012, 12:38 PM
First Gatlinburg dumps raw sewage into a trophy smallmouth river and gets basically a slap on the wrist for how they manage the facility and protect the surrounding water resource. I heard another person was killed there yesterday.
Now something like this might be coming. Can you imagine wading out on the river on a nice calm peaceful shoal and this blows by you. How would you feel if they did something like this on the South Holston, Watauga, or the Clinch river? How about the little river also? Wish there was some way to stop this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qBT-2yGXVwU

Corbo
02-24-2012, 12:42 PM
Expect there to be hourly traffic accidents on 66 because people are watching idiots ZIP across the river 100's of feet in the air.... some might even drive off the bridge!

Bad Idea... how many idots are there who will pay big money to fly over the river? I bet it fails due to high ticket prices and small profit margin.

ChemEAngler
02-24-2012, 02:23 PM
Expect there to be hourly traffic accidents on 66 because people are watching idiots ZIP across the river 100's of feet in the air.... some might even drive off the bridge!

Bad Idea... how many idots are there who will pay big money to fly over the river? I bet it fails due to high ticket prices and small profit margin.

Unfortunately there seems to be an endless supply of irrational tourists who just seem to have money spilling out of their pockets. I have seen ziplines similar to this one in elevation and length that charged $75/person, and the thrill of the experience just kept the line growing.

I avoid Sevierville/PF/G-burg like the plague. I still don't know why so many people go there and claim to be in the mountains....

cockeye valdez
02-24-2012, 02:56 PM
You may not want to hear this Troutman but as I was waiting for the water to go down on the so.ho. last week one of the shallow running jet boats screamed up the river.

I suppose air boats on low water will be next.

c.v.

Byron Begley
02-24-2012, 07:27 PM
I hate to show you this. I think this is what we are looking forward to. Check it out on YouTube.

Byron

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pbN4tvQD3Jk

Byron Begley
02-24-2012, 08:24 PM
Gary,

I didn't see the video you posted. Same company in New Zealand. Maybe the same kind of boats.

Byron

waterwolf
02-24-2012, 11:33 PM
First Gatlinburg dumps raw sewage into a trophy smallmouth river and gets basically a slap on the wrist for how they manage the facility and protect the surrounding water resource. I heard another person was killed there yesterday.
Now something like this might be coming. Can you imagine wading out on the river on a nice calm peaceful shoal and this blows by you. How would you feel if they did something like this on the South Holston, Watauga, or the Clinch river? How about the little river also? Wish there was some way to stop this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qBT-2yGXVwU

Good news for the latter 3 you mention is that the low water jet crowd will only get so far before they lose pieces of motors or hull to the rivers. If they could, they would already be there in mass.

You may not want to hear this Troutman but as I was waiting for the water to go down on the so.ho. last week one of the shallow running jet boats screamed up the river.

I suppose air boats on low water will be next.

c.v.
There is 2 air boats on the Holston now. I have seen them quite a few times in the last few years.

This jet boat thing is nothing new, they decimated the lower Pigeon around Newport years and years ago, by running out of Douglas to add smallmouth to their tournament limits.

If this bothers those of you who frequent the french broad, then why aren't you all raising holy **** over another serious threat? That threat is the new fad of river bass tournaments which have taken off in the last few years. That poses a serious threat versus an aesthetic threat to the river.

Corbo
02-25-2012, 07:08 AM
Well; I owned two jet boats (trackers) when I moved here and sold them as I didn't think I would have much use for them because I primarily avoid bass fishing. If you didn't know, BASS is a four letter word. LOL

When I moved here I found that both hulls were too heavy to run in most trout water; about the only place I think a jet would come in handy for trout would be the Clinch AND then it might be difficult to navigate without pissing off wade fishers.

There's is nothing that aggravates me more than someone motoring bye when I'm wading; this has happened to me on the Holston a few times and it puts the fish down.

At least most driftboaters offer an "accuse me" when they drift through your feeding lane.

Just wait until there is a "concordia" disaster when they strike a shoal at 40 miles an hour; it will happen.

MadisonBoats
02-25-2012, 10:24 AM
Good news for the latter 3 you mention is that the low water jet crowd will only get so far before they lose pieces of motors or hull to the rivers. If they could, they would already be there in mass.
......

Agreed, the point is large jet boats. I see small boats on the river every other day. However; I am probably one of the few people who goes up the river on low-water conditions. Lots of bottom scooting and not very practical for most motors. I saw the cowl hood off of a newer model 200 Black Max two-weeks ago below Massengill Bridge. Seems somebody hit a little bump.:eek: I am aware of a handful of boat flips/crashes in this area already in the past few months. One was particularly bad and I am surprised no one drowned.

......
When I moved here I found that both hulls were too heavy to run in most trout water; about the only place I think a jet would come in handy for trout would be the Clinch AND then it might be difficult to navigate without pissing off wade fishers. ....

Although the Clinch is wide; it is treacherous in many places and deceiving. Most boats do fine on one-generator; but, I would not even consider taking one out on any low-flows.

Knothead
02-25-2012, 10:52 AM
Anything for a buck! Tourism brings a lot of $$$$ into the state but where do we draw the line? If someone wants to live dangerously, drive through Atlanta during rush hour Friday evening.

Mike_Anderson
02-27-2012, 03:50 PM
Wait till they open three or four large commercial Kayak rental companies dumping hundreds of city folks into the river all day long,, every day. Tying up access areas for hours at a time, pouring trash into the river, bumping into you because they can't paddle, seeing who can smack their paddle against the water the loudest, picking fights with fishermen, being drunk and obnoxious, etc, etc. If you would like a preview of what that would be like come visit the Caney Fork this summer. It's pretty much ruined the river as a fishing destination.

Flat Fly n
02-27-2012, 04:32 PM
Maybe a few well placed signs to keep them off the river:

a) Raw Sewage discharged freguently! PS...Mostly Yankee sewage!

b) Remember the movie - Deliverance?

Grannyknot
02-27-2012, 04:41 PM
I saw the zip line structure this past weekend. I thought it actually blended in quite well with the rest of the area atrocities.

Corbo
02-27-2012, 08:49 PM
The few times I've headed into the Park to fish Greenbriar it was pretty much NON fishable due to tourists; all the best pools were full of people playing in the river or throwing a ball for their dog... then there are the fruit loops in Townsend.

At least I don't wade fish for trout near the 66 bridge on the French Broad.

QUESTION THOUGH... Because this jet boat business is taking PAYING CUSTOMERS on a motorize craft would all the operators be required to have Coast Guard approved & licensed CAPTAINS?

Anyone know if this is the law?

Half the businesses in Sevierville hire "Guest workers" or Ukrainians, russians etc. for the summer.... how would you like it if the Captain didn't speak English and you were screaming "Look out for the rocks"?

waterwolf
02-27-2012, 11:47 PM
This thread is pretty hilarious to be honest. I mentioned it earlier and will again since no one seems to understand what a true threat is to a resource.

A few fat tourists being driven up and down the river are a nuisance, and nothing more.

The real issue facing the FB is the tournaments being run on it numerous times each week. Since any of us who would be there would be fishing, the thing which should bother people is stuff that negatively impacts fishing. Not fretting over an aesthetic occurrence which may or may not happen, and could be rumor alone.

No wonder every TWRA meeting where regs are discussed finds the room void of fly fisherman, none care about the stuff which really matters.

Troutman
02-28-2012, 09:22 AM
Geez Jim, Its no wonder people keep leaving this forum. make a comment about how we don't like whats happening on the rivers and get lectured on how we dont understand the true issues. I wish I had the time to attend the meetings that twra and tva hold. My work hours prevent much of it ( health care)and I do enjoy my family time. I don't have a problem with general boaters on the rivers and lakes. I just hate to see another tourist attraction ruining another place I enjoy. I hope this is a rumor with the jet boats on the river. I have had a few problems with jet jons running close to me on the river but far less than idiots than are on the lake. I don't like tournaments and don't participate in any including the fly fishing ones. some people crave the competition, others like many on here just enjoy the fishing. I'm of the latter.

br549
02-28-2012, 10:24 AM
Here is a video of one of the jetboats in operation on the French Broad. This was obviously taken last summer. It seems it's not a rumor.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g7okk9MzZvs

silvercreek
02-28-2012, 10:27 AM
I notice none of these folks are wearing life jackets.

MadisonBoats
02-28-2012, 10:46 AM
Geez Jim, Its no wonder people keep leaving this forum. make a comment about how we don't like whats happening on the rivers and get lectured on how we dont understand the true issues. I wish I had the time to attend the meetings that twra and tva hold. My work hours prevent much of it ( health care)and I do enjoy my family time. I don't have a problem with general boaters on the rivers and lakes. I just hate to see another tourist attraction ruining another place I enjoy. I hope this is a rumor with the jet boats on the river. I have had a few problems with jet jons running close to me on the river but far less than idiots than are on the lake. I don't like tournaments and don't participate in any including the fly fishing ones. some people crave the competition, others like many on here just enjoy the fishing. I'm of the latter.

Troutman, there is a psychological condition for everyone. Some people are hard to classify and some wear it blatantly.

I personally think the biggest threat to our resources in pollution, lack of long-term development planning, and basic ignorance.

No Hackle
02-28-2012, 05:53 PM
What Gary said. Well put. Alot of the same people are the ones who have an opinion on everything and it's never positive. The watershed already has enough pressure. When does it stop and when it does,to what extent will it effect "us" flyfisherman.
Lynn

Corbo
02-28-2012, 06:21 PM
Perhaps a name change from French Broad to DOLLYRIVER.

I would say the operator in the video was irresponsible and reckless.... the fun & games will be over when someone gets hurt or killed.

waterwolf
02-28-2012, 11:43 PM
Geez Jim, Its no wonder people keep leaving this forum. make a comment about how we don't like whats happening on the rivers and get lectured on how we dont understand the true issues. I wish I had the time to attend the meetings that twra and tva hold. My work hours prevent much of it ( health care)and I do enjoy my family time. I don't have a problem with general boaters on the rivers and lakes. I just hate to see another tourist attraction ruining another place I enjoy. I hope this is a rumor with the jet boats on the river. I have had a few problems with jet jons running close to me on the river but far less than idiots than are on the lake. I don't like tournaments and don't participate in any including the fly fishing ones. some people crave the competition, others like many on here just enjoy the fishing. I'm of the latter.
**** Gary, just trying to make the point that there are serious issues facing many of our rivers, and Madison usually is quick to point those out. Pollution being a huge one he usually discusses, and rightly so.

I also work in health care, and also am busy just like the majority of folks in this country. However, it is all about taking the time to let your voice be heard. Griping about things on a forum won't change anything, but sending letters, sending emails, making phone calls, and reaching out to the local commissioners or elected officials can have a major impact. Every person has the time to send a letter or make a phone call.

I hate the thought of another tourist attraction as well, but when dealing with these resources you have to rank the threats by which ones could have the most serious impacts to the resource, and which are the most imminent threats.

My point is that sure a bunch of tourists buzzing up and down the river sucks, and sucks bad, but it isn't the end of the world. And it certainly won't destroy the fishery. The things which should make fisherman sit up and pay attention, get no discussion and when someone brings it up, everyone gets their panties in a wad.

So what threatens the future of the fishery on the French Broad? Over fishing, check. Pollution from numerous sources in Sevierville, check. Jet boats running the river, not so much IMO. If the first 2 are removed then focus on the tourist issue is all I am saying.

2weightfavorite
02-29-2012, 09:19 AM
I personally do not think that the jet boats will have any adverse affect on the fishing in the French Broad. Will they noisy and an eye soar, well yes, but what affect can they have on the fish? We also must keep in mind we are talking about a relatively small stretch of river when compared to leangth of the river overall. Everyone wants to bash the tourists, but touists feed my, and a thousand other peoples families. Tourists keep hotels, resteraunts, gas stations, and a million other bussines' busy, not to mention Little River Outfitters. No tourists, no LRO. As for whoever said "all the good holes" in Greenbriar were taken by swimmers and dog fetchers, I have a hard time believeing that. Sure the bottom 4 big holes, which are less than 800 yards into the park, are known swimming holes and popular with locals and tourists in the summer. Heaven forbid you have to drive 2 more miles up the road to fish. 600,000 acres, 1000 miles of stream, there is room for everyone.

MadisonBoats
02-29-2012, 10:59 AM
**** Gary, just trying to make the point that there are serious issues facing many of our rivers, and Madison usually is quick to point those out. Pollution being a huge one he usually discusses, and rightly so.

I also work in health care, and also am busy just like the majority of folks in this country. However, it is all about taking the time to let your voice be heard. Griping about things on a forum won't change anything, but sending letters, sending emails, making phone calls, and reaching out to the local commissioners or elected officials can have a major impact. Every person has the time to send a letter or make a phone call.

I hate the thought of another tourist attraction as well, but when dealing with these resources you have to rank the threats by which ones could have the most serious impacts to the resource, and which are the most imminent threats.

My point is that sure a bunch of tourists buzzing up and down the river sucks, and sucks bad, but it isn't the end of the world. And it certainly won't destroy the fishery. The things which should make fisherman sit up and pay attention, get no discussion and when someone brings it up, everyone gets their panties in a wad.

So what threatens the future of the fishery on the French Broad? Over fishing, check. Pollution from numerous sources in Sevierville, check. Jet boats running the river, not so much IMO. If the first 2 are removed then focus on the tourist issue is all I am saying.

I agree with this idea. Also; I think it is good to discuss and debate topics in an honorable way. There have been many good posts on this forum that have educated me and helped me change my stance or make a better educated stance on a topic. We just have to remember we all share the passion for fly fishing and we are more effective as a group than as an individual.

highstick
02-29-2012, 01:19 PM
There is alot that goes into this activity that is not good for the that river beyond the tourists and eye sores.

The majority of that river has high mud banks and only a small portion of that is armored by rock. How will the wave action of those jets running at 50 mph up and down the stream all day work out for that river?

The shoal where the little pigeon meets that FB is a large coble flat and I have seen many fish at a time spawing there. Watch the Smoky mountain jet boat video on you tube and the blow through that doing a "drifting turn".

I dont know how many of you have seen how much traffic goes through one of these attractions. I dont have a hard number my self but this will be far more than a few trips up and down a short stretch of river. "Wahoo" ziplines is the company I would assume is doing this already runs a zip line business in Pigeon Forge. Huge numbers of folks. HUGE.

I mean I am sure I could right several ways this is bad and cant see at all how it is sustainable tourism. I am sure they can sustain their profits but that resource is going to be hammered.

If I owned property on that river I would raise absolute ****.

The way that county has already stuck it to the Little Pigeon System is appauling. This is just another.

No Hackle
02-29-2012, 03:14 PM
I agree with Highstick. Those boats are going to ruin a fish on the bed. They won't tollerate that kind of pressure. Will they be running the boat into the LP. It will really mess those fish up. Very narrow up past Boyds Creek bridge.
Lynn

Steve Wright
02-29-2012, 03:42 PM
How will the wave action of those jets running at 50 mph up and down the stream all day work out for that river?




Probably alot less than the 18000 cfs TVA pumps down the river channel ;which most property owners don't like ???????

waterwolf
02-29-2012, 03:53 PM
Probably alot less than the 18000 cfs TVA pumps down the river channel ;which most property owners don't like ???????

Exactly right Steve. There is no amount of boat traffic which equals the damage done by high tailwater flows. The mud banks wouldn't exist if there was no generation. Also, on the same front, nothing destroys spawning grounds faster then a massive flood, which occurs daily on all our tailwaters.

flyguys
02-29-2012, 06:34 PM
I know it's not a very good river bait, but how about a few dt22 crankbaits thown in the general direction of the jet boat. No telling what you could hook!!:biggrin:

JoeFred
02-29-2012, 10:49 PM
Having just moved to the Nolichucky River area a few months afterward, I first learned of this tragedy straight from the still grieving mother of the young man whose body was recovered. He was the owner of the 16-foot aluminum Grizzly with a 40-horsepower jet drive.

http://greenevillesun.com/Local_News/article/Body-Recovered-From-River-Near-Boat-Wreck-Site-id-313929

Corbo
03-01-2012, 07:42 AM
Well gang I suppose that if enough folks are trully passionate about preserving what's left of this section of river it would be time to ORGANIZE an oppositional effort... raise money. hire an attorney, petition that State Resource agencies and get the Feds engaged in this debate.

Very good talking points have been raised; is there now a "call to action"?

What troubles me most is that this is a public resource that is being "developed" into a commercial resource with many negative consequences.

Obviously operation of the Douglas Dam has changed the natural character of the river hence there are many "recreational, environmental and habitat losses" associated with "Peaking flows"...

BUT this "taking" is legally measured by the Federal Energy Regulatory Commision against the need for electrical power that is considered a necessity of the common public "good".

State & especially Federal agencies seek a BALANCED use of our rivers... this is not a balance

br549
03-01-2012, 02:08 PM
Having just moved to the Nolichucky River area a few months afterward, I first learned of this tragedy straight from the still grieving mother of the young man whose body was recovered. He was the owner of the 16-foot aluminum Grizzly with a 40-horsepower jet drive.

http://greenevillesun.com/Local_News/article/Body-Recovered-From-River-Near-Boat-Wreck-Site-id-313929

Tragic indeed. But, this is not the same type of jetboat. Jetboats have been ran by fisherman for many many years out west, in Alaska and yes here in TN. That was being reckless. No life jacket on, running when the Chucky was High and Fast, and running in the dark. Insert any type of watercraft and the same tragedy can happen.

Now the recreational boat that is shown on the French Broad being ran by the zipline company goes a bit faster and is designed to do all the spinouts etc. Which I have no problem with in and of itself as long as they are insured properly and carry all of the necessary safety equipment. The problem starts when they start interfering with other users of the river like canoeist, kayakers and anchored boats. They can run a yacht up the river if they choose, just obey the laws.

JoeFred
03-01-2012, 03:44 PM
... The problem starts when they start interfering with other users of the river like canoeist, kayakers and anchored boats. They can run a yacht up the river if they choose, just obey the laws.

br549, I agree completely. It's just that Byron's YouTube post of the "bigguns" racing through those gorges in New Zealand got me thinking, are they soon going to jetting tourists up as far as Asheville?? JF

br549
03-01-2012, 04:27 PM
JoeFred, Probably if they could figure out how to do it!!

Looks to me like if you were rolling down Fort Loudon Lake on a summer Saturday driving your boat like that, the TWRA or Blount County patrol boats would be issuing citations for reckless driving.

Steve Wright
03-01-2012, 05:04 PM
JoeFred, Probably if they could figure out how to do it!!

Looks to me like if you were rolling down Fort Loudon Lake on a summer Saturday driving your boat like that, the TWRA or Blount County patrol boats would be issuing citations for reckless driving.

Sure wish they would target ski doos .....starting to see them on rivers as well

Steve Wright
03-01-2012, 05:57 PM
This thread is pretty hilarious to be honest.

I agree ; .....to me this latest endeavor is the newest member to the parliament of whores that pimps out our natural resources .

Knothead
03-01-2012, 06:44 PM
three or four large commercial Kayak rental companies dumping hundreds of city folks into the river all day long,, every day
Sounds like the Hiwassee from 11 AM to 8 PM when they are running two generators for the Michelin hatch.

waterwolf
03-01-2012, 11:31 PM
I agree ; .....to me this latest endeavor is the newest member to the parliament of whores that pimps out our natural resources .
Don't get me wrong, I have no use for these types of business ventures, but if we are going to get crazy with this one, then we might as well start down the list. Canoes on the Caney, ATV's on public lands, horses on public land etc etc etc. The list would be endless, and the best approach IMO is to target the most serious threats and go after them, along with the threats which are winnable arguments. This particular one, will be extremely difficult to win without a massive overreach by the govt.


One thing which confuses me, is where will they launch or base such an operation? Getting a dock permit on the river is tough, and if that is their plans one phone call and that permit won't happen.

JoeFred
03-02-2012, 01:41 AM
The zip line launch tower and the anticipated assembled shirtless masses along TN 66 got me thinking about the good old days... when men were men, daredevils were Evel and a uniform could just bear your name and some stars in place of Red Bull decals.

Classic footage: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=llzIVDbvSAc

Corbo
03-02-2012, 07:51 AM
How about a few before & after pictures of the river banks? Let them spend a bunch of money putting this whole thing together and then seek an injunction based on riverbank degredation.

The soft banks are indeed exposed when there is no generation in the immediate area of this proposed activity BUT normal operation & generating flows do not create wave action that causes the river to get muddy or the banks to wash out.

The occassional power boat doesn't cause any discernable harm to the riverbanks but I suspect a fleet of large craft with 400 plus motors continuously romping about on the river will definately create a hazzard to other boaters and cause erosion.

I am not a videographer or a photographer..... who wants to step up and document the river as it is now?

Steve Wright
03-03-2012, 10:54 AM
The soft banks are indeed exposed when there is no generation in the immediate area of this proposed activity BUT normal operation & generating flows do not create wave action that causes the river to get muddy or the banks to wash out.



It is called "mass wasting" ......the erosion from the soil being saturated during generation & subsequent drying ; numerous cycles during a week that break off the banks as much as the shear force/velocity of the current. These cycles are far less frequent in freestones.
Unfortunately, this occurs more below Cherokee than most other tailwaters. I know of four "toeheads" ( small islands) that existed prior to the 70's ;that are totally gone now.This was before jet boats & the recreational pressure of today.

waterwolf
03-03-2012, 12:43 PM
It is called "mass wasting" ......the erosion from the soil being saturated during generation & subsequent drying ; numerous cycles during a week that break off the banks as much as the shear force/velocity of the current. These cycles are far less frequent in freestones.
Unfortunately, this occurs more below Cherokee than most other tailwaters. I know of four "toeheads" ( small islands) that existed prior to the 70's ;that are totally gone now.This was before jet boats & the recreational pressure of today.

Coldwater farms on the clinch is a great example of this, when we built the pavillion 20 years ago there was 50 yards of land between it and the river, now there might be 5 feet. Also people who fish at the jail should note the rip rap banks which weren't there until recently because of the bank issues caused by tailwaters flow variations

Tnstonefly
03-08-2012, 05:04 PM
Here's a link to the zip-line's site. Apparently they offer food, the zip line, jet boat shuttle to and from the zip lines and jet boat tours. They are scheduled to open this march, on the site they have a short video which does show a jet boat similar to the one on the video Byron posted.

http://discoverattractionsinthesmokies.com/_attract/french-broad-jet-boat-and-zipline-sevierville-tn.htm

Corbo
03-08-2012, 05:44 PM
Went past the site today and they are putting up some kind of building on the South side that is rather large and close to the road. No doubt so passers-by on route 66 will see all the fun available.

Much of Sevier County is an eye full if not an eye sore but this spectcle next to a busy highway will cause accident for certain due to RUBBER NECKING.

NOW AS TO EROSION on the CLINCH, FRENC BROAD OR HOLSTON ... The Federal Power Act, NEPA etc and the Federal Energy Regulatory Commission regulary reviews an on going "shoreline management plan" for every project impoundment.... it is too bad that for the most part dam operators are not held responsible for their discharge and the environmental harm down river.... sorta like once the water passes over or through the dam the operators are no longer responsible for problems beyond the projects immediate tailwater. Of course there are down river water commitments that must also be met..... like enough water to adequately dillute wastewater treatment or enough cool water to chill out a nuke plant or other non-hydro energy producer or water for a papermill etc.

IMO this is gross negligence whether it be on the Clinch or anywhere else. In Maine We (meaning the Kennebec Chapter of TU & the Kennebec Coalition) "intervened in opposition to well more than a dozen hydro re-kicensing proceedures and sucessfully fought for "issues" on impoindments, issues below the dams and changes in the flow regime not to mention recreational "enhancements"....

I personally wrote all those documents for many years on behalf of the Kennebec chapter and our partners... and we were very sucessful but it took fifteen years. It is expensive however and takes a large committment in time, energy and money. All you need to get what you want is the resolve!

There is no longer an Edwards Dam on the Kennebec.... National TU had virtually nothing to do with it but of course they now take all the credit! What's important is that you can get what you want if yu want it bad enough.

Been there done that.... you who are concerned need to organize! Feel strongly enough perhaps I can show you how it is done & won.


BTW... I am not a liberal environmentalist whacko.... politically I make Newt G. look like Dennis Kucinich.... I just love rivers too much....

waterwolf
03-08-2012, 11:51 PM
Went past the site today and they are putting up some kind of building on the South side that is rather large and close to the road. No doubt so passers-by on route 66 will see all the fun available.

Much of Sevier County is an eye full if not an eye sore but this spectcle next to a busy highway will cause accident for certain due to RUBBER NECKING.

NOW AS TO EROSION on the CLINCH, FRENC BROAD OR HOLSTON ... The Federal Power Act, NEPA etc and the Federal Energy Regulatory Commission regulary reviews an on going "shoreline management plan" for every project impoundment.... it is too bad that for the most part dam operators are not held responsible for their discharge and the environmental harm down river.... sorta like once the water passes over or through the dam the operators are no longer responsible for problems beyond the projects immediate tailwater. Of course there are down river water commitments that must also be met..... like enough water to adequately dillute wastewater treatment or enough cool water to chill out a nuke plant or other non-hydro energy producer or water for a papermill etc.

IMO this is gross negligence whether it be on the Clinch or anywhere else. In Maine We (meaning the Kennebec Chapter of TU & the Kennebec Coalition) "intervened in opposition to well more than a dozen hydro re-kicensing proceedures and sucessfully fought for "issues" on impoindments, issues below the dams and changes in the flow regime not to mention recreational "enhancements"....

I personally wrote all those documents for many years on behalf of the Kennebec chapter and our partners... and we were very sucessful but it took fifteen years. It is expensive however and takes a large committment in time, energy and money. All you need to get what you want is the resolve!

There is no longer an Edwards Dam on the Kennebec.... National TU had virtually nothing to do with it but of course they now take all the credit! What's important is that you can get what you want if yu want it bad enough.

Been there done that.... you who are concerned need to organize! Feel strongly enough perhaps I can show you how it is done & won.


BTW... I am not a liberal environmentalist whacko.... politically I make Newt G. look like Dennis Kucinich.... I just love rivers too much....

Good info Corbo, and I am a lot like you when it comes to stuff. I have a deep love for this countries natural resources and especially our rivers/streams. I am a right wing radical conservative on the majority of issues but drift to tree hugger land when it comes to our lands and waterways for the most part.

dizzyg
05-13-2012, 09:20 PM
Since the TWRA boat ramp under the bridge is currently closed until 2014 the only access to the french broad in sevierville is via the little pigeon. This weekend the-dip ****s in the jet boat ran from the bridge down to the the confluence of the LP and up the LP where they do a quick turn and return the same route. They almost ran over a friend of mine in the small channel connecting the two as he floated down (low water). Since he was coming from the LP into the FB he was not visible from an upriver stance on the FB. Not only did the narrowly miss him on the way into the LP, they did not slow nor avert there course once they turned and were headed back out to the FB while he was literally in the narrow channel connecting the two. These folks aren't going to be in business too long as they are going to incur a wrath of complaints right up until the point they actually kill someone.

Corbo
05-13-2012, 10:31 PM
Sounds like OPERATING recklessly! You should report such behavior immediately to TWRA AND the Sevier County Sheriff. If someone was operating an automobile like this they would be arrested.

Somebody is going to be injured or killed by these idiot thrill seekers; boating like this is not recreational in any traditional sense, it's all about making money.

Knothead
05-14-2012, 11:02 AM
If someone was operating an automobile like this they would be arrested.
This may be off the subject but it doesn't happen around here. I am amazed how people drive and yet don't have accidents. Speed limits, stop sign, traffic lights are a mere suggestion, not a law.

Rodonthefly
05-14-2012, 03:47 PM
I fished the piegon Saturday, and on my way in, A TWRA agent was on his way out. I stoped and talked to him for a few. He never did ask me for my lic. One thing I asked him was, how they planed on handeling this jet boat or deal. He told me that he went and spoke to the owner of the jet boat tour/ zip line and told him clearly that if he seen anyone of the his boat captians running high rates of speed, doing dough nuts or etc. "He was writing ticketts and or maybe hauling them to jail". I said thats great but you had better plan on camping out down there, and I also asked if I was fishing and one came running past me like a bat out of ****, if I could shoot and claim self deffence. He just laughed, and asured me that it would not get out of hand.

ChemEAngler
05-14-2012, 08:17 PM
I am amazed how people drive and yet don't have accidents. Speed limits, stop sign, traffic lights are a mere suggestion, not a law.

So, you know my father-in-law... :biggrin:

Corbo
05-15-2012, 03:15 PM
They leave that fancy Jetboat parked in the river on the north side 24/7; just sayin....

waterwolf
05-15-2012, 07:10 PM
I understand this causes an aesthetic issue, but if you read what trout man posted the other day you will see a much larger issue, and one that actually poses danger to the resource. Tournaments on river bass will destroy and has destroyed fisheries.

That deserves conservation focus long before this which is trivial to a degree when the two are compared.

Knothead
05-16-2012, 10:05 AM
has destroyed fisheries
waterwolf, could you give some specifics on this? Inquiring minds want to know. Thanks.

waterwolf
05-16-2012, 11:39 AM
waterwolf, could you give some specifics on this? Inquiring minds want to know. Thanks.
The pigeon river below Newport drew the attention of tournament guys on Douglas, and in 2 years time they converted it from one of the best smallmouth stretches to an area where virtually no bass existed. Saddest thing I have ever witnessed, and it is now starting to affect both the French broad and holston.

This is a real and serious threat, those who worry about these rivers would be better served focusing on the tournaments rather than an a hole in a boat

Troutman
05-16-2012, 12:30 PM
While I do hate the fact. that the jet boat ride attraction is here and wish it would go bankrupt. Waterwolf is correct in the fact that the river tourneys are a much worse problem. I've always thought of the rivers as an escape from the stress on dealing with all the boaters on the lakes. Constant local bass tourneys with high speed boats running everywhere 3 nights a week and usually all day of saturdays on douglas lake. Now there are national bass tourneys coming here.
Now some local clubs have sprung up that invade the warm water tailwaters every weekend. This past saturday was one of them launching at 7 islands WMA access. I found out through some messaging on another forum that it started out as a small tournament for some employees at a knoxville cement plant with maybe 8-10 boats. It has grown over the past several years into 30-50 boats every sat. morning on the french broad during the spring and summer. IMO, if every boat was able to catch a limit of bass, 1 -20" smallmouth and the rest largemouth, think about how many fish would probably die after riding around, bouncing through shoals, in a tin boat waiting for a 1pm weighin time. Mortality is probably very high. Those are the spawners for the future of the fishery. I can see how that would decimate the fishery in just a few years.
I dont think many of these tournament fishermen care about mortality rates but rather just the chance to win a small bundle of cash and have some short term bragging rights with buddies. I have talked with a couple of customers at work that fish tournaments on the lakes and its all about competition and having a 40K boat to ride around in. Ive heard many complaints about the size limit on smallmouth and how they want it lowered so they can cull more in the livewell before a weigh-in.
I have expressed my concerns with TWRA via email and to several officers in person. I am happy to see they are spending more time on the rivers this year. I have seen them checking people on the lil pig on both forks recently. So far I have only seen one officer in a jon boat on FB but maybe they will keep an eye on the tourneys and the jet boat ride attraction.

br549
05-16-2012, 01:04 PM
I could not agree more with the bass tournament problem. The French Broad is virtually unfishable now on Saturday mornings due to that particular tournament. The upper river above Douglas had the misfortune of being fished and then those fish boated back downstream usually to Douglas Dam to be bagged, weighed and released. I'm sure mortality on the weekender local tournaments are large and even larger when we are talking about aluminum boats. I would rather see them kept and cleaned then wasted like they are now.