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Thread: Elkmont 6/26/08 & "grumpy bear"

  1. #11
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Maryville, TN
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    174

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    Bear spray isnt a bad idea. I carry a can on me when i fish in the park. It will spray a huge cloud of the stuff 25-30 ft out. You have around 8 seconds of spray depending on the size of the can. You can have it in their face before they even get close. Mine is rated at 2% which is the strongest the EPA allows in bear spray.

  2. #12
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    Mar 2008
    Location
    Waynesville, NC
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    250

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    50 Feet is plenty far enough for me. I was in Cataloochee two years ago and it had rained up Palmer Creek so I went up the first small creek to the right above the horse camp. I made it about 40 yards up the creek, just out of sight of the trail and had already caught 4 little brook. I casted around a small tree to my left and set the hook on another speck when at my feet on the right creek bank a 300 pound bear jumped up and took off running. I don't know if it was because I was in full camo, or if he was sleeping, or what...but He was under my feet when he took off, I went the other way just as fast. My 2 buddies were still in the trail and had heard a downed tree that was leaning fall. They thought it was me until I stepped out white faced...needless to say, I ALWAYS carry my A2 tool steel Bark River.

  3. #13
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    Feb 2008
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    2,516

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    Quote Originally Posted by jeffnles1 View Post
    I HOPE I'm never close enough to a bear that I can stick him with a knife.

    I suppose as that last great act of defiance, the knife would be something you could use in a last stand, but I think the bear has a longer "reach" than I do. By the time I'm close enough to stick him, he's already had more than ample opportunity to smack me silly.

    Heck, even most handguns (even if they were legal to carry in the park) are not going to drop a bear in his tracks, especially any handgun you'd carry in a concealed carry mode and want to lug around fishing all day. 9MM, 45, 38, 357, etc. would probably kill a bear eventually, but unless one was quite lucky, I doubt if they would make the kind of impression on an angry bear that most would think.

    The loud bang would probably scare it off better than a bullet impact.

    I'm by no means a "bear expert" so my approach is to try to make noise on the trail and to do the best I can to avoid close encounters with them.

    I think I would need some extra baby wipes if I was 50' from a bear that was growling at me.

    Jeff
    You may be right, but from my experience a .40 cal or better will definitely drop a 300lb man, but men aren't bears lol. Have any of you guys ever seen that "lion attack" video on YouTube? If you haven't, look for it on there. There are 3 guys and their wives hunting in Africa when one of them pops a male lion at about 100 yards with a rifle. Man was that lion TICKED OFF! He charges them and I won't tell you the rest because it would ruin the story...Check it out though. It's a trip. As far as mace, I too carry it, but it's in addition to my ridiculously big bowie that I carry in the back country. If I'm by the road, I just carry a 5 inch pocket knife. I would imagine that a bear would have reach on you. If he's swating, you might have a chance, but if he just bull rushes you, I hope you have the knife out already and are darn good at dodging rushing defensive linemen with huge claws and teeth!

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
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    546

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    My wife and I always carry bear spray with us. There are many "Garbage Dump" bears that don't act like bears are supposed to. There are a lot of bear incidents occuring that are not made public. Two bears killed a Cosby Woman above Elkmont, I've been stalked up there myself, but he decided not to cross the river after my son joined me. Udap and Counterassault are two well known brands. Do a search of this forum and you will see a lot of threads.
    We buy it in the Yellowstone area and keep it in our cars and under our bed when we return.
    We carry "counterassault" Counterassault.com. (Reccommended by NFS personnel in Shonshone and Gallatin forests) costs about $50 a cansister has a shelf life of about 4 years. Spray stays good just loses some propellant after that time. Non lethal- very effective, and legal.
    I feel we'll probably use it on some one's fido or on the "Banjo Pickers" that haunt the stream above Elkmont before on a bear.. PLAY IT SAFE- JUST DON'T GO UP THERE, THERE AREN'T ANY FISH UP THERE ANYWAY!!(:>)

    Maybe this is a product LRO might want to carry??

    Kytroutbum
    Randall Sale

  5. #15
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    Jun 2007
    Location
    Northern Kentucky
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    Blue,
    A 40 or a 45 will kill a bear, but probably not before he has done whatever it was he was going to do to you. Their hide and fur are MUCH thicker than a human. A typical hollow point bullet one would be firing from a 40 would not expand in a bear the same way it would on a human.

    I used to hunt a lot. Never hunted for bear but have a number of buddies who do. One friend hit one square in the lungs with a 30-06 rifle. The bear flinched, looked at him and continued ambling along on its merry way. 3 solid hits from that rifle later, the bear dropped. Another buddie hit one square with a 44mag that he had loaded VERY hot (max charge listed in the reloading books). This guy is a very experienced hunter and a good shot. He tracked the bear for over 3/4 mile before he found it dead.

    Both of these firearms are far more powerful than any calibre one would typically carry as a self defence weapon. Given those experiences, I wouldn't consider a handgun anything more than a last stand weapon for a bear attack. I suppose they would be better than kicking and punching but I wouldn't count on it to drop an angry bear in its tracks.

    Pepper spray would most likely have a more immediate effect in knocking the wind out of his sails and one wouldn't have to worry about where the bullet landed should he/she miss.

    I still compete in target shooting events and from time to time serve as a range officer but I don't hunt any more and, thank the Lord, I've never fired a weapon at another person and pray that I never have to.

    Sounds like you may have (or still) are a police officer or military person. If that is the case, thank you for your service. I appreciate the job you do (or have done).

    Jeff

  6. #16
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    Feb 2008
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    Jeff,

    I used to be in the Army (infantry), and later in the TN National Guard. I've been to a lot of deserts. I never fired on a man with a handgun, just heard some stories. A rifle is a different story. No situation is good with a big bear. Thankfully they have all ran from me when I have came upon them. So far anyeay.

  7. #17
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  8. #18
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    279

    Default Just for information sake...

    the bears that killed the cosby woman were put down by park rangers who used their 40 cal service weapons. I would suppose that a 12 guage with rifled slugs would be preferable, but then again this is theory because the current legal climate forbids the posession or use of firearms within park bounderies.

    Having used pepper spray a time or two, one key thought to remember is to not empty the can while a bear is too far away for it to affect it. My use of the spray has been for defense against dogs when riding my bike. I recall one occasion in which I was riding at nioght and could not see the dog chasing me. I could hear him clsoing in and literaly felt his breath on my hand that was extended with the spray in it. At that point I sprayed him, and he immediately retreated. The next day I rode by and saw that the dog involved was a huge Chow. He started after me again only to turn and run away once he spotted the can in my hand again.

    I don't suggest waiting until a bear gets that close, but I do suggest that you do your best not to panic and empty the can before it comes into range.

    Mike
    "Fly-fishing has many attributes, but none more pleasing than it's ability to liberate the young boy that still hides within me and to let that boy live again without embarrassment or regret, sorrow or anguish." Harry Middleton

  9. #19
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    Jun 2007
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    Northern Kentucky
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueRaiderFan View Post
    Jeff,

    I used to be in the Army (infantry), and later in the TN National Guard. I've been to a lot of deserts. I never fired on a man with a handgun, just heard some stories. A rifle is a different story. No situation is good with a big bear. Thankfully they have all ran from me when I have came upon them. So far anyeay.
    Blue,
    Off topic, but thank you for your service. It's the sacrifices by men like you and countless other men and women that allow me the freedom to sit on a comfy couch with a laptop computer on my knee and type these words in peace, security and without worry.

    As a nation, I don't think we say it enough, but allow me to say it again, thank you.

    Jeff

  10. #20
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    May 2008
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    Maryville, TN
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeffnles1 View Post
    Blue,
    Off topic, but thank you for your service. It's the sacrifices by men like you and countless other men and women that allow me the freedom to sit on a comfy couch with a laptop computer on my knee and type these words in peace, security and without worry.

    As a nation, I don't think we say it enough, but allow me to say it again, thank you.

    Jeff
    I'll have to second that Thank You!!

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