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Thread: stream size and elevation

  1. #11
    Join Date
    May 2007
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    Gadsden, Alabama
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    1,033

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    Flyguys don't worry about being a bother. Thats why we all get on here to ask questions and to learn from each other. I think you had a very valuable question and the answers you got helped me to remember IAN RUTTERS book that I had forgot to pick up. So your question even helped me.
    Romans 10:9-10 KJV

  2. #12
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    Sep 2008
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    west tn
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    Thanks guys, I have the Lawrence book and the Rutter book, both full of info. Can't wait to get Mr. Casadas book and learn even more on the art of flyfishing! Looks like it could be in the works for Christmas!! flyguys.

  3. #13
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Rock Hill, SC
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    992

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    flyguys--I haven't read the other postings in reply, and that's intentional. I'll look to see what others think after I respond.
    On size, I consider widths of 15-25 feet medium-sized and anything above that a large stream (by Smokies' standards).
    As for elevation, the magic number for me is 3500 feet. Above that I consider a stream to be high elevation, and the number is also a pretty good arbitrary figure for where you'll likely begin to find specks. Obviously that's a generalization, but it covers a lot of situations. Jim Casada

  4. #14
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    Sep 2008
    Location
    west tn
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    234

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    Mr. Casada, Thanks for the information! I'm sure it will come in handy on my next trip to the smokies. Thanks, flyguys.

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Bucyrus, Ohio
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    133

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    I was talking to Ian Rutter last year at the fly fishing show in Cincinnati, and he said that 2400' was kind of the magic level for trout in the smokies, from there on up you can usually catch trout in the summer. I would keep an altimeter in my car and would usually not fish a stream until I was above that level. You don't realize how much elevation you gain when driving into Greenbrier, about 1000' at the entrance, about 1800' at porters creek, about 2500' at Ramsey trailhead, and about 4500' at the cascades.
    Tad

  6. #16
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    Sep 2008
    Location
    west tn
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    tlshealy, An altimeter in the car, huh? Never would have thought of that one. Makes sense though. Anything (legal) that can swing the odds in my favor, I'm all for it!

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Rock Hill, SC
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    Tad--Although Ian is a very knowledgable, astute, and observant angler, I would have to disagree sharply with hiss 2400-foot elevation statement. I'll give several examples, and I checked maps just to be sure. You are way above Bradley Fork's juncture with Luftee before your reach 2400 feet, and above Chasteen Creek on Bradley Fork before attainting that elevation. Lower Deep Creek is full of fish at all seasons and well below 2400 feet in elevation, and indeed the same holds true for the lower end (sometimes several miles) of almost every major stream on the N. C. side of the Park--Noland, Forney, Hazel, Eagle, and Twentymile Creeks. You can catch trout from the mouth right on upstream in all of them, even at the peak of summer heat. I think it's more a matter of flow, oxygenation, and other factors than merely elevation. Indeed, I think a strong argument could be made for expanded areas suitable for trout (and reduced ones for smallmouth) in Park streams over the past 50 years. The explanation is simple--once open areas where there were old fields now have ample overhead canopy. In truth, you'll find wild trout, even in the hottest days of summer, in almost all Park waters except lower Abrams Creek and maybe the lower Park reaches of Little River (though there are some browns in the deeper holes and 'bows in riffles in the latter). In short, my feeling is that if you are fishing almost anywhere inside the Park you are in trout territory. Jim Casada

  8. #18
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Dickson Co. TN
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    161

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    Jim,
    I think I've read this in your book somewhere,do most all of the year round park creeks hold trout,even the small creeks?
    I know that the fish would be very small in a small creek,but have wondered about the creeks that don't show up on maps as fishable.
    Rick

  9. #19
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Rock Hill, SC
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    Rick--I think virtually every little creek in the Park with any size at all holds trout. There are a few exceptions. Lower Abrams Creek is too warm and possibly lower Little River a portion of the year, and there are a few streams which are apparently too acidic to be suitable habitat. Personal observations, observations by my brother, and considerable research by Bobby Kilby has turned up a few such streams. I suspect the Park fisheries biologists know of others. But I have constantly been amazed, over all my life, at the places where you can find trout--sometimes three- or four-inchers in tiny branches. Jim Casada
    www.jimcasadaoutdoors.com

  10. #20
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Lenoir City, TN
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    Not as a way to promote competition among us, but rather with the waters and what it takes to experience them, I've been trying to come up with a way to register current day reports by trusted anglers/hikers who have caught/seen trout in the small Park streams. I could record the sightings on my web site, but refuse to do so in a manner that would call undue attention to the individual or take unfair advantage of information gained from this great message board. And...no. I'm not talking about revealing "honey holes." Just the stream name, possibly citing, when deemed necessary, confluences of other steams. For example, "Little Jonas Creek above its confluence with Yanu Branch." Feel free to comment or shoot holes in this. Just please don't shoot me.

    JF
    Last edited by JoeFred; 11-23-2009 at 07:11 AM.
    “Joe” Fred Turner
    Southern Appalachian Stream Maps sasMaps.com
    Formerly SmokyStreams.com

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