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  #11  
Old 05-08-2009, 08:40 AM
Knothead Knothead is offline
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Interesting post and threads. If attacked by a bear, would an oak limb or a rock be considered a weapon? If we can't use a bear spray, rock , limb, etc., to defend ourselves, what then, would be legal? Sounds like a can of worms.
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  #12  
Old 05-08-2009, 07:36 PM
mcfly mcfly is offline
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C'mon guys. Those black bears in the park are more mild mannered and tame than my labrador retriever. Unless you regularly carry New York strip steaks duck-taped to your waders, I'm not sure what everyone is so worried about. And in the exceptionally rare event that one charges you while fishing, use that 6-9' whippy pole we call a fly rod. Seriously? And that same labrador mentioned above ate 5 habenero pepper and 2 jalepeno pepper plants, with mature peppers on them, when he was 4 months old with no ill effect whatsoever. Didn't phase him. Do you really think that pepper spray is going to stop a starving 500 lb. black bear? Seriously?
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  #13  
Old 05-08-2009, 07:41 PM
yoursmokies yoursmokies is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcfly View Post
Do you really think that pepper spray is going to stop a starving 500 lb. black bear? Seriously?
According to an internal memo and public reports from the US Fish and Wildlife service it works better than guns do.
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  #14  
Old 05-08-2009, 08:48 PM
mcfly mcfly is offline
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Spray works better than guns do? I have two things to say to that: 1) look at the source of the memo 2) Re-read that sentence and think hard about it. I'll help you while you think about it. Pros of guns= 1. loud scary bang 2. fast moving, deadly bullet. Pros of Spray= 1. very tasty to animals apparently. Gives an extra jolt to that human flesh that they are about to eat 2. Kinda hurts their eyes a few minutes.

Survey most bears and I think they'll agree that they would enjoy eating capsasum flavored flesh more than dying while attacking a stupid human that did something incredibly ignorant to provoke an attack by a almost domesticated black bear.

I read a lot of internal memos at work that were created by morons. The company would never release these internal memos to the public because it would make it look like it was being ran by a troop of monkeys. The fact that the US Fish and Wildlife service actually published this proves that they are being ran by a group of people with an IQ close to that of a troop of monkeys.

How would you test that (pepper spray works better than a gun)? Get two people, one with a gun and one with spray, do something moronic to provoke a black bear, then see which person dies first?

Last edited by mcfly; 05-09-2009 at 12:10 AM..
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  #15  
Old 05-08-2009, 08:58 PM
yoursmokies yoursmokies is offline
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Excerpt from 1 report

since 1992, persons encountering grizzlies and defending themselves with firearms suffer injury about 50% of the time. During the same period, persons defending themselves with pepper spray escaped injury most of the time, and those that were injured experienced shorter duration attacks and less severe injuries

Give me pepper please...
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  #16  
Old 05-08-2009, 09:13 PM
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BlueRaiderFan BlueRaiderFan is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yoursmokies View Post
According to an internal memo and public reports from the US Fish and Wildlife service it works better than guns do.

I've SEEN it on Grizzlies...It works big time. You may have to use a little more depending on the situation (e.g, a sow and her cubs, vs a territorial male that you didn't surpirse..The sow will be much more ticked off). Of course, the best thing to carry is the spray, a gun and a knife in a sheath on your side all at once. Start with the spray and work your way down!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U-n51xxF8K8

Have you seen the bear guy in Alaska that owned "bear haven or heaven?" I saw him use it on a griz and it worked just fine. Having said that, this bear was attacking another bear, but still, it was obvious that the bear did not like it at all.
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  #17  
Old 05-08-2009, 09:15 PM
yoursmokies yoursmokies is offline
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Originally Posted by BlueRaiderFan View Post
Start with the spray and work your way down!
I like your style.

The fish must quake when you wade into a stream!
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  #18  
Old 05-08-2009, 10:24 PM
Kytroutbum Kytroutbum is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcfly View Post
Seriously? And that same labrador mentioned above ate 5 habenero pepper and 2 jalepeno pepper plants, with mature peppers on them, when he was 4 months old with no ill effect whatsoever. Didn't phase him. Do you really think that pepper spray is going to stop a starving 500 lb. black bear? Seriously?
Spray works better than guns do? I have two things to say to that: 1) look at the source of the memo 2) Re-read that sentence and think hard about it. I'll help you while you think about it. Pros of guns= 1. loud scary bang 2. fast moving, deadly bullet. Pros of Spray= 1. very tasty to animals apparently. Gives an extra jolt to that human flesh that they are about to eat 2. Kinda hurts their eyes a few minutes

Mcfly- 1)These two statements show that there is a need to research the proper use of Bear Spray repellant. The canisters carry detailed instructions on usage, spraying around your campsite is not one! The second line on my can of Counter Assault states not to use it on tents, clothing etc.

2)I usually spend 3 to 5 weeks 2 of every 3 summers in the Greater Yellowstone Ecosystem- Gallatin and Shoshone National Forests fishing the Beartooth Mountain High lakes and Clarks Fork of the Yellowstone drainage. I have more concern over Yogi, Boo-Boo and their Smoky Mt.s friends who have lost fear of humans than I do the those brown bears.

3)To test the preference of bears to the Capsaicin, I would suggest going to Cades Coves smearing yourself with Honey and another person with Capsaicin and letting the cute little furries lick it off ya! Some tourist could get some good pictures.
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  #19  
Old 05-08-2009, 10:27 PM
mcfly mcfly is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yoursmokies View Post
Excerpt from 1 report
Notice that is says "1" report. I'm guessing the source is the aformentioned monkeys in the Fish and Wildlife Service.

Quote:
Originally Posted by yoursmokies View Post
since 1992, persons encountering grizzlies and defending themselves with firearms suffer injury about 50% of the time.
Meaning 50% survive, with no injuries to beat!

Quote:
Originally Posted by yoursmokies View Post
persons defending themselves with pepper spray escaped injury most of the time
No percentage given, meaning that the report was glamorized to convey a preset goal of supporting the use of spray, the initial purpose of the report. Again, probably written on the order of one of the Wildlife service monkeys. And, on the reports admittance, spray does not work 100% of the time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by yoursmokies View Post
those that were injured experienced shorter duration attacks
Sounds great! Nice way to spend the evening!

Quote:
Originally Posted by yoursmokies View Post
Give me pepper please...
I believe Darwin says it best.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueRaiderFan View Post
I've SEEN it on Grizzlies
I've seen it not work, and ironically, end with a firearm. And that is no lie.

Quote:
Originally Posted by yoursmokies View Post
Having said that, this bear was attacking another bear, but still, it was obvious that the bear did not like it at all.
Enough said. Obviously, the bear was not attacking the person with the spray in the first place. And ironically, the grizzly was being attacked by another grizzly. Obviously, neither grizzly was carrying spray. Of course, if either grizzly were carrying spray, he would have been protected.

Some more points:

1)Grizzly hunters use guns, not pepper spray.
2)Carrying firearms in the park is a felony and will result in a prison attack by a big hairy man who looks like a grizzly!
3)A Grizzly bear and a cute, friendly smokies black bear are two totally different animals. Grizzlies attack unprovoked. You have to be carrying food or do something stupid to provoke an attack by the Smokies black bear. If you are doing either on a regular basis, then, again, Darwin said it best.
4) If you fish in Grizzly country, then carry something! Spray, bazooka, something!

Not trying to be mean or knock on anyone, but my point is please use your head when around ANY animal in the wild. I'm afraid people will start spraying black bears that are not attacking, and will unlikely attack, and thus will end-up provoking an attack. If a black bear is attacking, you have done something to cause it! Again, not the same thing with grizzlies.
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  #20  
Old 05-08-2009, 10:53 PM
mcfly mcfly is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kytroutbum View Post
Mcfly- 1)These two statements show that there is a need to research the proper use of Bear Spray repellant. The canisters carry detailed instructions on usage, spraying around your campsite is not one! The second line on my can of Counter Assault states not to use it on tents, clothing etc.
I never mentioned spraying bear spray on a tent! Why would you spray bear spray on a tent? That is stupid! If you are really that stupid, read those instructions twice or more! And stay away from me while I'm fishing!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kytroutbum View Post
3)To test the preference of bears to the Capsaicin, I would suggest going to Cades Coves smearing yourself with Honey and another person with Capsaicin and letting the cute little furries lick it off ya! Some tourist could get some good pictures.
I'm guessing the bear will go for the food. This is one of my points. Be careful with food! And if he is licking, he isn't attacking. Now, on the other hand, if the bear is provoked, he could attack either person. Likely it would be the one provoking, regardless of what he is wearing. And I decline your offer; I don't spread food on myself for bums from kentucky!

As I said before, I witnessed an uprovoked grizzly attack. Been around literally hundreds of smokies black bears, sometimes while carrying food. Never even been close to an attack.
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