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  #11  
Old 08-03-2010, 11:45 PM
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Part of the excitment of fishing is finding your own favorite spots and learning the water.
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  #12  
Old 08-04-2010, 12:22 AM
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I mentioned on another thread why I haven't been posting; for me, it's been a simple lack of time...my kids are getting older, and thre's always something going on. As for naming streams or not - let your conscience be your guide. I am sort of a small-stream specialist; when I come up to the Smokies, I don't have much time, and I need to find eager fish. Now, if I eventually reach my goal, and some fine day in the future I will move up there permanently and retire, I might get into fishing the larger streams, targeting bigger fish - right now, I just don't have the time.

My "home" stream is Cosby, and I have to say that I've hardly seen anyone else fish it while I've been there. I remember one time I ran into some guys with spinning gear, who were complaining about the "lack of water" and were wondering where some deeper water was. I explained there was plenty of water there, but that given that stream and the time of year, they were probably wasting their time. I was up this weekend, and I did see one other fly fisherman, coming off Walker Camp when I was coming off Road Prong - that was a rarity. The good thing is, the small streams that can't take the pounding are usually also off the beaten path, and let's face it, most people are inherently lazy. For the most part, I've had the streams to myself, unless you count the strange looks I get from hikers.
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  #13  
Old 08-04-2010, 07:43 AM
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Default Thanks for all you answers - But if I could harass you some more

Like Mr Casada I do tend to only post things that are a few miles back where most people won't venture. I also don't post things if the person taking me wants it that way. Yes I have seen the posts in the past over more fisherman = more fish, but still want to know how high pressure on a small stream could effect the stream. Has there ever been a case of Brookies getting fished out? I spoke with both Matt Kulp & Steve Moore on this specific issue, and they both said fisherman have little to no impact and that maybe people just wanted the stream for themselves. So what I'm looking for - is there any good reason (except maybe solitude) that stream names should not be posted. While I have not ever gotten into a heated debate over this issue, on some boards naming streams will get you blasted. Just curious if I'm looking over any pertinant info.
Thanks again
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  #14  
Old 08-04-2010, 08:46 AM
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I agree with duckypaddler in that most of the smaller streams without roadside access aren't going to be hit by a bunch of folks in any case. You won't see many guys carrying worms and crickets 2 miles up a trail then another mile or two off trail. Those types jump out of the car and walk 50 feet.

I wonder if someone picked some random small stream that is hardly ever mentioned here like say trillium branch or something and then posted a bunch of lies about how awesome it was and that it is an undiscovered brookie paradise. Caught 100 brookies in 30 minutes with a bunch of pics. Then set up a trail cam near the mouth of said stream to see if you caught anyone going up in there. For some reason I bet money it wouldn't work. Mentioning streams without easy access I don't think will make any difference and 99% of people that read it would look at the map and say 'I don't think so'. However, mentioning certain sections or spots on easily accessible streams with good road or trail access that others may have overlooked or not be aware of could increase the pressure in that spot but probably only temporarily and not enough to fish it out but that is just a guess.
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  #15  
Old 08-04-2010, 11:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crockett View Post
I agree with duckypaddler in that most of the smaller streams without roadside access aren't going to be hit by a bunch of folks in any case. You won't see many guys carrying worms and crickets 2 miles up a trail then another mile or two off trail. Those types jump out of the car and walk 50 feet.
Unfortunately, the few that would go to all the effort will do a lot of damage to a stream. If you ever want to hear some stories about poaching in the park, stop by Big Don's in Cherokee (near the trophy section) and just start chatting. He has lots of stories of poaching all over on both sides of the ridge, including such gems as Goshen and Fish Camp Prong on our side of the hill. It only takes 2-3 guys taking a few hundred fish to really ruin things...and they usually went in groups of at least 5-6. The bait guys that are lazy usually aren't a threat anyways because they don't know what they are doing. However the ones that can really fish are often just as successful as the best fly fisherman (if not much more so) and are willing to go to some effort to have a good day just like us...
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  #16  
Old 08-04-2010, 11:49 AM
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I have 2 points of view on this topic.

1) I think discussion of the lack of enforcement and the infrequency of license checks could do more harm than naming streams. A poacher is more likely to be emboldened if he/she believes there is little chance of getting caught.

2) The Smoky Mountains is one of the most visited National Parks in the system (may even be the most visited). Most streams already get a lot of pressure and many streams run right alongside a road or major hiking trails. The more remote streams are not going to get a lot of pressure because most are either too lazy, or do not have the time to hike into them. I'm not lazy, but I rarely have the luxury of time to hike in to a back country camp site and spend a couple days (wish that were not the case). The park belongs to all of us and I seriously doubt if any of us are going to be the first fishermen to ever find some remote stream and drop a line.

While I'm not going to post "go to the 3rd dead Hemlock tree, then find the second big white rock and toss a green weenie just about 6" in front of the rock next to it" (that info would be of little value anyway), I see no harm in saying I was fishing Middle Prong above the Institute, or Sam's Creek, or Walker Camp Prong above Alum Bluff's Cave Trail, or pick your stream and general location. Me and a couple hundred of my best friends will fish that stretch of stream this year.

Adding 5 or 6 more who may be reading this forum and not already know about the secret locations isn't going to appreciably increase the fishing pressure.

Then again, telling every poacher or potential poacher who may read this message board that he/she isn't likely to get caught could harm the fishing experience.

I know about 3 years ago when I first started fishing the park, I found the information here and the people on this board to be very valuable and the folks to be helpful. It was and is much appreciated.

Opinions may vary.

Jeff
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  #17  
Old 08-04-2010, 12:40 PM
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On the one hand, giving out too much info may entice the poachers, but at least from my point of view, also spreading out that information may get more ethical fisherman there as well.

I say this because from own perspective, when I would only visit here once or twice a year I would primarily end up fishing somewhere right by the side of the road. Since moving here, following this message board, and reading both Rutter's and Casada's books, I spend more time exploring new (to me) and harder to reach places. What is the end result? One more person spending time on a stream (which I hardly bump into another fisherman anymore since I have stopped fishing roadside), observing what is going on, and taking note of any suspicious activity. I know that no one wants to go their favorite spot and see it crammed with a bunch of people, but without at least a certain bit of dissemination of knowledge, it also keeps out those of us who will report of problems and take care of said stream.

How often do you visit these out of the way places to find a bunch of trash that someone has left there? I know encounter this regularly, so I know that people other than responsible ones are already visiting these places, so it seems to me that getting more responsible people out there is a good thing. And like I said, without the level of disclosure already mentioned, I'd probably still be spending every trip to the park by the side of a road.
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  #18  
Old 08-04-2010, 01:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duckypaddler View Post
Like Mr Casada I do tend to only post things that are a few miles back where most people won't venture. I also don't post things if the person taking me wants it that way. Yes I have seen the posts in the past over more fisherman = more fish, but still want to know how high pressure on a small stream could effect the stream. Has there ever been a case of Brookies getting fished out? I spoke with both Matt Kulp & Steve Moore on this specific issue, and they both said fisherman have little to no impact and that maybe people just wanted the stream for themselves. So what I'm looking for - is there any good reason (except maybe solitude) that stream names should not be posted. While I have not ever gotten into a heated debate over this issue, on some boards naming streams will get you blasted. Just curious if I'm looking over any pertinant info.
Thanks again
duckypaddler, along those same lines, when I spoke with Matt and Steve recently, Steve offered his opinion that people who haven't already been to the brook waters up high are not going to go now (loosely quoting). I tend to believe that is largely true as well... regardless of how much information is put out there (books, maps, posts, blogs, etc.). The it's-not-gonna-happen sentiment may be just part of today's video game, NASCAR, etc. culture, but I thiink we would do well to volunteer some information that might offer a challenge to perhaps a father and son would might otherwise miss out on a great backcountry camping/fishing experience in this one of a kind Park.

JF
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  #19  
Old 08-04-2010, 04:53 PM
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I'm personally not big into naming stream names for many of the same reasons Plateau Angler mentioned. And, I really don't mind if other members provide names of streams. I usually find it sufficient to name a general area.

I have answered a number of emails that inquire about streams and locations and really don't mind doing so.

To each his own.
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  #20  
Old 08-04-2010, 05:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrouseMan77 View Post
I have answered a number of emails that inquire about streams and locations and really don't mind doing so.
I like the way you roll! Email is the perfect way to clarify information so it isn't out there for all the lurking masses...
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