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  #21  
Old 02-17-2011, 09:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Jim Casada View Post
...one has to wonder why the limit isn't seven or even ten fish (both figures were, at one time, the limit in the Park).
This is one of the issues I was intending to question this evening. Why have a size limit, and increase the creel limit for fish.
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  #22  
Old 02-17-2011, 10:04 AM
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... I have had three different fishermen, all of them folks who have fished Deep Creek for decades (and I'll give names--Mac Brown, who has done guiding off and on over the years; Jim Estes, a skilled angler who does some guiding for Rivers Edge; and Jim Mills, a veteran rodmaker and angler from the Whittier area) indicate their feelings that this fishery has declined appreciably. ..Jim Casada
Jim, I'm just curious if you think a staffed satellite office of Fisheries Management near the Oconaluftee park entrance might be beneficial to observing/analyzing relative population densities, and possibly other differences, between the TN & NC sides. There may already be a continuing presence over there, but I am not aware of it.

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  #23  
Old 02-17-2011, 10:59 AM
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Hans, if otters are low in number in most of Europe then it would follow they are not much of a threat to trout. They are not a threatened species in North America. I'm not sure the European situation has any bearing here. Regards, Sivercreek
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  #24  
Old 02-17-2011, 11:32 AM
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Silvercreek,

They have never been much of a threat to trout in Europe. Also, I know the Otter in the U.S. is not a species of concern for conservation. However, it is not as widespread and have had huge habitat loss, therefore reintroduction is taking place.

I still don't believe the river otter in the U.S. to have much different feeding habit than the European one. I respectfully disagree with you.
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  #25  
Old 02-17-2011, 11:39 AM
Jim Casada Jim Casada is offline
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Fred--I really don't have an answer, although I do suspect that the N. C. side of the Park gets a bit of a short shrift here as in so many other areas (Park headquarters on TN side, almost all key personnel historically based on TN side, historically more expenditure of funds on the TN side, etc.). That isn't going to change, although I can assure you it doesn't sit well with local residents.
I would be keenly interested in knowing when the last scientific stream survey (general, as opposed to focusing specifically on specks) was done on the N. C. side, and I would likewise love to know what is going on with Deep Creek. Something is amiss there.
Interesting point.

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  #26  
Old 02-17-2011, 11:41 AM
tennswede tennswede is offline
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Dr. Casada,

I was merely showing you and others who are supposedly very well versed in the english language that it's sloppy to keep insisting that it's Scandanavia. No harm intended. I guess I just hold you in a higher regard, especially since you have a distinguished academic background and a Phd. I on the other hand, can barely write and speak the american english. I am the first one to tell you that it is not easy to write and speak in a foreign tongue. I'm sorry for my lack of proper grammar but you know, I flunked college here in the states and went fishing instead.

As for my comment on Abrams, just a little jab at you, since you seem to take yourself very seriously to the point of becoming frustrated with opponents . Lighten up, it's not the end of the world if someone disagrees with you. Have a good day and lets hope we both are wrong, so Otters can coexist with the trout.
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  #27  
Old 02-17-2011, 12:08 PM
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Here's a link to the "Otter Family Tree". Information (short version) obtained at Wikipedia, under search for: Otter

http://www.myphotos.yahoo.com/s/20yakcy0osufoi4rslo4
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  #28  
Old 02-17-2011, 12:16 PM
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Silvercreek,


I still don't believe the river otter in the U.S. to have much different feeding habit than the European one. I respectfully disagree with you.
Hans, no disagreement. I never said anything about feeding habits. Just that with few otters in Europe, it would follow that they would not be a threat to trout or to much of anything for that matter. You took my comment further than its content. No problem, just setting the record straight. Regards, silvercreek
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  #29  
Old 02-17-2011, 12:42 PM
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If the pro-otter side of this issue is correct, then we don't have anything to worry about. How will that be determined? By opinion? Don't think so.

If the con-otter side of the issue is correct and nothing is done, then we can look forward to a future for trout fishing that will be in steady decline. If they are wrong, then let science prove it and we can all breathe a little easier.

Just because something is not "up in your face" right away, does not mean it isn't a serious problem festering in the background. Without any natural otter predation, save for environmental pollution, the problem may be irreversible for a long time before it's eventually stopped and reversed, just like the man made pollution of a by-gone era that eventually destroyed speck trout habitat and otter habitat.

Otter presence in great numbers is a "barometer" for environmentally sound waters. They are highly susceptible to pollution, but then again so are trout. Acid rain may be eventually change this, but as for now, it doesn't appear to be contributing to watershed pollution directly.

To continue to ignore a potentially disastrous situation without adequate scientific attention is fool hardy in my opinion. This is not fear mongering, it is a shared concern of many that something is amiss. Using "clinical" evidence from a totally different region of the world to dispute there is a problem, is not in the best interests of our fishery.

So let's continue to play a part, voice our concerns and encourage biological science to intervene and make an educated, scientific analysis of the situation and a final determination as to what does or does not need to be done.

We owe that to future generations who may one day want to fish for trout in GSMNP.
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  #30  
Old 02-17-2011, 01:00 PM
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Silvercreek,

No problem, I got carried away.


Whitefeather:

" Using "clinical" evidence from a totally different region of the world to dispute there is a problem, is not in the best interests of our fishery"


We need to remember that the Brown trout is European by origin, they should be somewhat used to predation from Otters. But if the american otter is so different from the european as people on here suggests then that might be a moot statement.
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